Clemenz With a ”Z” Podcast

EP 167 This Was Supposed The Place #7: From Church to Cult of Personality: Pastor Worship and the Idolatry of Leadership

What happens when a church stops being about community and starts revolving around one man? In this episode of Clemenz With a Z, I continue the “This Was Supposed to Be the Place” series by digging into the idolization of pastors—starting with Kip McKean in the ICOC, and then zooming out to the wider church culture where pastor worship, branding, and platform-building have taken center stage. I reflect on my own experiences, both in the church and beyond, and explore what happens when our faith is shaped more by charisma than by Christ. This one’s about power, presence, and what church could still be—if we’re brave enough to imagine it.
If you are a member, were a member, or know someone who was a part of the ICOC or ICC and would like to share your story about life in and out of the church, I’d love to hear from you. But also—if something from this episode hit home for you… if you’ve ever found yourself centering your faith around a pastor, a personality, a system… and you’re working your way through it—I’d love to hear your story too.
Maybe it’s time we talk about it together, out loud. You can reach me anytime at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com, or send me a DM on Instagram at the Clemenz With a Z podcast page.
If this episode resonated with you, please take a second to rate and review the show—it helps more people find these conversations and this space. And as always: I’m just a channel. I ain’t the source.
If you’d like to support the podcast financially, you can follow this link: https://gofund.me/7ebb0524. Or you can head to clemenzwithaz.com and grab a sticker or something cool from the shop. Every little bit helps keep this going—and I’m so grateful for it.
Until next time, stay honest, stay grounded, and keep growing. Peace.

EP 166 The Land Of "Should": The Nicely Packaged Pressure That Follows You Everywhere

In this episode of Clemenz With a Z, I dig into the quiet, heavy weight so many of us carry: the pressure to be who we’re supposed to be. From labels like “gifted” to the roles we’re assigned in school, church, and family, I unpack how early expectations can shape our sense of worth—and how hard it is to break free from the “land of should.” I talk about the pressure to lead, to be the strong one, the good one, the faithful one—and what it means to start asking who am I, really? This episode is about healing, honesty, and slowly walking away from the roles we never chose. If you’ve ever felt like you’re performing your life instead of living it, this one’s for you.
If this episode hit something in you—or if you’ve been carrying a story, a label, or a weight you’re finally trying to lay down—I’d love to hear from you. You can reach me by email at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com, or send me a DM on Instagram at the Clemenz With a Z podcast page.
And if there’s something you wish you could say out loud—something you’ve been sitting with but haven’t found the space to share—I’d be honored to hold that space for you.
As always, if you enjoy the podcast, please rate and review—it helps more people find these stories. And don’t forget: I’m just a channel, I ain’t the source.
If you’d like to support the podcast financially, you can follow this link: https://gofund.me/7ebb0524. Or you can head over to clemenzwithaz.com and grab a sticker or something cool from the shop. Every little bit helps keep this going, and I’m deeply grateful for it.

EP 165 This Was Supposed To Be The Place #6: We Dont Worship Idols, Just Everything About Church

This was supposed to be the place.The place where I’d grow. Where I’d feel safe. Where God would feel close.But somewhere along the way, the church became something else—something heavier.In this episode, I reflect on how the desire for connection slowly got replaced by the pressure to conform… and how the church I was born into started to feel less like a community and more like something we worshipped.Not God—but the church itself.And the more I’ve looked around, the more I’ve realized: this isn’t just a “my church” thing. This kind of idolatry—where we elevate the system, the brand, the building, the leaders—shows up in churches everywhere.This episode isn’t about throwing the whole thing away. It’s about telling the truth.Because when we start worshiping the place instead of seeking the Presence…We lose what the place was supposed to lead us toward in the first place.
If you are a member, were a member, or know someone who was a member of the ICOC or ICC and would like to share your story about life in and out of the church, I’d love to hear from you. Together, we can continue exploring the question, “We were in a cult? Or If this episode stirred something in you, if you’ve wrestled with what church has meant in your life, or if you just have a story you want to share, I’d love to hear from you.
Whether you want to process something, reflect, or even come on the podcast—feel free to reach out.
You can contact me via email at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com, or send a DM on Instagram at the Clemenz With a Z podcast page.
If you’re enjoying the show, please take a moment to rate and review—it really helps more people find these stories.
And remember: I’m just a channel. I ain’t the source.
If you’d like to support the podcast financially, you can head over to clemenzwithaz.com and grab a sticker or something from the shop.
Or, you can follow this link: https://gofund.me/7ebb0524. Every little bit helps keep this going, and I’m so grateful for it.
Until next time—take care of yourself, stay grateful, and keep growing.
Peace.

EP 164: We Were In a Cult? Greg's Story

In this episode of Clemenz With a "Z," I sit down with former member of the ICOC Greg to unpack the winding road that led him from a Catholic upbringing into the heart of the ICOC. Greg’s story is one of spiritual searching, family dynamics, and the slow unraveling of certainty. With honesty and depth, he shares what it felt like to be swept up in a system that promised purpose—but delivered pressure. This conversation is part of our ongoing “We Were In a Cult?” series, and it's another raw, powerful reminder that healing begins with telling the truth. Whether you’re deconstructing, recovering, or just curious, this episode is for you.
If you are a member, were a member, or know someone who was a member of the ICOC or ICC and would like to share your story about life in and out of the church, I’d love to hear from you. Together, we can continue exploring the question, “We were in a cult?”—and perhaps find some healing along the way. You can reach me via email at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com, or send me a DM on Instagram at the Clemenz With a Z podcast page.
As always, if you enjoy the podcast, please rate and review—it helps more people find these stories. And don’t forget: I’m just a channel, I ain’t the source.
If you’d like to support the podcast financially please follow this link: https://gofund.me/7ebb0524
Also—if you’d like to support the podcast financially, you can head over to clemenzwithaz.com and grab a sticker or something cool from the shop. Every little bit helps keep this going, and I’m so grateful for it.
Until next time, take care of yourself, stay grateful, and keep growing. Peace!

EP 163 This Was Supposed to Be the Place #5: From Shame to Something Sacred

What happens when the place that was supposed to offer belonging, love, and healing becomes the very thing that teaches you to be small? In this episode of Clemenz With a "Z", I explore how my time in the ICOC—and the broader evangelical culture I grew up in—shaped the way I saw myself, God, and the meaning of worth. From the story of the Garden to the image of the Cross, I unpack how scripture and church culture taught me that I was broken at my core—and how that belief followed me into every part of my life. But I also talk about what happens when you start to question that story. When you realize it wasn’t God who made you feel that way—it was people. This is an honest reflection on shame, self-erasure, and the journey toward a more freeing, more loving spirituality.
As always, if you enjoy the podcast, please rate and review—it helps more people find these stories. And remember: I’m just a channel, I ain’t the source.
If you’d like to support the podcast financially please follow this link: https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 or, you know, grab a sticker or maybe even a tank top (because apparently, every scene has merch)—you can head over to my new website: 👉 www.clemenzwithaz.com
You’ll find ways to support the show, check out new updates, and maybe pick up something to wear that says, “Yeah, I’ve been thinking about some things too.”
Until next time—stay open, keep asking, and keep walking. Peace!

EP 162 A Tale of 2 Concerts: From the Church Stage to the Sticky Floor

n this episode, I share the story of attending two very different concerts in the same week—one a high-energy worship night with Phil Wickham, Kristian Stanfill, and Cody Carnes, the other a gritty, laid-back rock show by Pepper. On the surface, these shows couldn’t have been more different... but as I stood in both spaces, coffee in hand at one and beer in hand at the other, I started noticing some surprising similarities. This episode isn’t about bashing anything—it’s about asking questions, noticing patterns, and exploring where the sacred can actually show up. Because maybe God isn’t just behind the worship curtain—maybe He’s in the pit, too.
If any of this resonated with you, please take a second to like, subscribe, rate, or review the show— it helps more than you know, and it helps others find these conversations too.
If you'd like to connect, you can reach out to me at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or DM at the Clemenz With a "Z" instagram page. 
If you would like to support the podcast financially please follow this link: https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 or
If you’d like to support the podcast financially please follow this link: https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 or, you know, grab a sticker or maybe even a tank top (because apparently, every scene has merch)—you can head over to my new website: 👉 www.clemenzwithaz.com
You’ll find ways to support the show, check out new updates, and maybe pick up something to wear that says, “Yeah, I’ve been thinking about some things too.”
Until next time—take care of yourself, stay grateful, and keep growing. Peace.

EP 161 The Truth About Control: A journal, a quote, and the quiet cracking underneath it all.

In this episode, I hit a wall—and I don’t clean it up. I talk about what it feels like to be doing all the “right” things—therapy, journaling, movement, rest, reflection—and still feel like I’m falling apart. I wrestle with the chaos of life, the illusion of control, and that haunting thought: “Is this how it’s always going to be?” Along the way, I reflect on a line from Living Buddha, Living Christ that shifted something in me: “It’s not a matter of faith. It’s a matter of practice.” This isn’t an episode with answers. It’s one with questions. The kind that stay with you long after you stop recording. If you’ve ever felt frustrated by the gap between your effort and your peace—this one’s for you.
As always, I’m not here to give you answers. I’m just here to ask the questions out loud— and maybe help you feel a little less alone in asking yours.
If this resonated with you, please take a second to like, subscribe, rate, or review the show— it helps more than you know, and it helps others find these conversations too.
If you'd like to connect, you can reach out to me at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or DM at the Clemenz With a "Z" instagram page. 
If you would like to support the podcast financially please follow this link: https://gofund.me/7ebb0524 or head over to www.clemenzwithaz.com and buy a sticker or something.
Take care of yourself. Be gentle with what you’re carrying. And I’ll see you in the next one.

EP 160 This Was Supposed To Be The Place #4: Faith, Fear, and the God I Was Taught to Obey Unpacking obedience, manipulation, and the slow work of healing.

In this episode of Clemenz With a Z, I open up about the fear-based faith I was raised in—specifically within the International Churches of Christ (ICOC)—and how it shaped my view of God, love, obedience, and myself. From childhood memories of fearing hell, to moments of spiritual panic, guilt, and manipulation, this episode is a raw unpacking of what happens when fear becomes the foundation of belief.
But this isn’t just about the ICOC. I’m seeing the same fear-based messaging alive and well in churches today—from pulpits to podcasts, just dressed up in nicer language and cooler branding.
I talk about the day everything shifted—the moment I realized it wasn’t God I was afraid of, but people’s version of God. This is an episode about unlearning, about healing, and about daring to believe in a love that doesn’t punish.
Whether you’ve been part of the ICOC, another high-control church, or are just trying to untangle fear from faith, this one is for you.
Thank you for tuning in to this episode of Clemenz With a Z. This one was personal. It was heavy. And it was necessary.
If you’ve ever been made to feel like fear was love… Like obedience was the only way to be seen by God… I just want to say—you’re not alone.
This episode came out of my own story, but I know so many of you have lived through versions of this too. And if you’ve got something to say, if you’ve got a story of fear, faith, and figuring it out— I’d love to hear it.
If you’re a member, former member, or know someone connected to the ICOC or ICC, and you want to share what life was like inside—or outside— please reach out.
Together, we’re still asking the question: “Were we in a cult?” But more than that… we’re doing the work to heal from it.
You can email me at clemenzwithaz@gmail.com or DM me on Instagram at the Clemenz With a Z podcast page.
And hey—if this episode moved you, if it helped you name something, or even made you feel less alone… please rate and review the show. It really does help these conversations reach the people who need them most.
If you would like to support the podcast financially please follow this link: https://gofund.me/7ebb0524
Until next time, take care of yourself, stay grateful, and keep growing. Peace!